Author Topic: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished  (Read 10938 times)

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« on: January 30, 2018, 08:17:10 PM »
Stagecoach are reviewing their Norfolk operations by the looks of things

https://www.klfm967.co.uk/news/klfm-news/2491026/stagecoach-wont-provide-norfolk-bus-services/

Offline barryb

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2018, 09:27:56 PM »
I wish I could understand why they bought Norfolk Green in the first place, particularly given so much of it consisted of routes they'd previously abandoned...

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2018, 11:31:47 PM »
https://www.lynnnews.co.uk/news/breaking-news-stagecoach-consulting-on-proposal-to-close-king-s-lynn-bus-depot-1-8356470

Quote
BREAKING NEWS: Stagecoach consulting on proposal to close King’s Lynn bus depot

Published: 17:15 Tuesday 30 January 2018

Bus operator Stagecoach has announced it is carrying out a review of its Norfolk operations, including the potential closure of its Lynn depot.

Managers say they have met with union representatives and launched a consultation exercise with staff.

The company says it is also working with Norfolk County Council on “steps to protect as much of the local network as possible.”

Stagecoach took over most of West Norfolk’s bus services when it bought Norfolk Green in 2013.

However, Andy Campbell, managing director of its eastern division, said this evening: “We are a significant local employer and we understand the importance of bus services for the local community. We also know that any change can be unsettling for our people.“

''That’s why we are working closely with both the trade union and local authority to protect as many jobs and as much of the local network as possible.“

We’re carrying out a consultation and will be working liaising closely with staff during that process.“

However, the reality is that we simply cannot sustain the current operation given the challenging economic climate that we’re faced with.”

The firm says staff could be relocated with other operators or elsewhere in the Stagecoach East business within the surrounding area.

Bosses say workers will be able to discuss their preferences over the coming weeks.

A Norfolk County Council spokesman said: “It’s disappointing that Stagecoach are considering no longer operating in West Norfolk and we are sorry to hear this news.

“However, we will work as closely as we can with them to ensure passengers are kept informed of changes and the network is covered by alternative providers as much as possible.”

« Last Edit: January 30, 2018, 11:40:49 PM by Coast_Hopper »

Offline Tony

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #3 on: January 31, 2018, 05:59:53 PM »
They will finish at the end of April....

Offline al_557

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #4 on: January 31, 2018, 06:20:15 PM »
They will finish at the end of April....
Is that confirmed?


Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #5 on: January 31, 2018, 06:58:56 PM »
I believe that has been a date mentioned, also found out that Stagecoach are looking to keep the Spalding route amd possibly some in Cambridgeshire ie Wisbech, suppose this could go under the Peterborough

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #6 on: January 31, 2018, 07:00:15 PM »
Also reported Steve Knight page that Konnectbus will take over the X29 between Fakenham and Norwich Monday to Saturday

Offline dennisdart

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #7 on: January 31, 2018, 07:26:55 PM »
A friend of mine who lives that way has the following information - as far as I am aware not yet confirmed by the companies concerned.

"Stagecoach Norfolk Green will retain the Long Sutton outstation which supplies buses for the 505 to Spalding and the Wisbech local services all of which they will continue to operate. They will also retain the 46 to March but otherwise will pull out of Kings Lynn. This will leave Lynx as the sole operator on the Hunstanton service. Lynx will also operate the X8 to Fakenham but the X29 from Fakenham-Norwich will pass to Konect. Lynx will also operate the Coasthopper but only as far as Wells with the section from Wells-Cromer being taken over by Sanders.

Some of the more lightly trafficked town services such as the 4 (Pandora Meadows) and the 5 (Gaywood Park) may be taken over by West Norfolk Community Transport using minibuses and some Solos. Not quite sure what will happen to the busier Kings Lynn routes such as Fairstead but Lynx must be the favourite to take these on. Speculation is rife as to whether they will acquire Stagecoach Norfolk Green's operating centre in Kings Lynn and/or any vehicles/staff"

I do not know how much of this is fact or fiction, but from some of the posts I have seen some of it appears to be fact.

I am sure there will be many more more rumours before the 90 days is up.

Offline Tony

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #8 on: January 31, 2018, 09:08:34 PM »
Is that confirmed?

In reply to someone on twitter they send they would end at the end of April.... 

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2018, 09:16:08 PM »
A friend of mine who lives that way has the following information - as far as I am aware not yet confirmed by the companies concerned.

"Stagecoach Norfolk Green will retain the Long Sutton outstation which supplies buses for the 505 to Spalding and the Wisbech local services all of which they will continue to operate. They will also retain the 46 to March but otherwise will pull out of Kings Lynn. This will leave Lynx as the sole operator on the Hunstanton service. Lynx will also operate the X8 to Fakenham but the X29 from Fakenham-Norwich will pass to Konect. Lynx will also operate the Coasthopper but only as far as Wells with the section from Wells-Cromer being taken over by Sanders.

Some of the more lightly trafficked town services such as the 4 (Pandora Meadows) and the 5 (Gaywood Park) may be taken over by West Norfolk Community Transport using minibuses and some Solos. Not quite sure what will happen to the busier Kings Lynn routes such as Fairstead but Lynx must be the favourite to take these on. Speculation is rife as to whether they will acquire Stagecoach Norfolk Green's operating centre in Kings Lynn and/or any vehicles/staff"

I do not know how much of this is fact or fiction, but from some of the posts I have seen some of it appears to be fact.

I am sure there will be many more more rumours before the 90 days is up.

First group need new depot as well so Stagecoach might sell to the highest bidder lol

Lynx won't buy any vehicles from them that's 100% guaranteed
« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 09:17:41 PM by Coast_Hopper »

Offline Steves

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #10 on: February 01, 2018, 12:51:53 AM »
A friend of mine who lives that way has the following information - as far as I am aware not yet confirmed by the companies concerned.

"Stagecoach Norfolk Green will retain the Long Sutton outstation which supplies buses for the 505 to Spalding and the Wisbech local services all of which they will continue to operate. They will also retain the 46 to March but otherwise will pull out of Kings Lynn. This will leave Lynx as the sole operator on the Hunstanton service. Lynx will also operate the X8 to Fakenham but the X29 from Fakenham-Norwich will pass to Konect. Lynx will also operate the Coasthopper but only as far as Wells with the section from Wells-Cromer being taken over by Sanders.

Some of the more lightly trafficked town services such as the 4 (Pandora Meadows) and the 5 (Gaywood Park) may be taken over by West Norfolk Community Transport using minibuses and some Solos. Not quite sure what will happen to the busier Kings Lynn routes such as Fairstead but Lynx must be the favourite to take these on. Speculation is rife as to whether they will acquire Stagecoach Norfolk Green's operating centre in Kings Lynn and/or any vehicles/staff"

I do not know how much of this is fact or fiction, but from some of the posts I have seen some of it appears to be fact.

I am sure there will be many more more rumours before the 90 days is up.

The speculation above seems plausible at the very least.  Surely the 505 must be profitable to maintain the frequency that it does including a Sunday service.  Hunstanton would have been more profitable without Lynx but Stagecoach must have come to the conclusion that it could not get rid of Lynx by either running it into bankruptcy or buying them out in any acceptable timescale. It is possible that they thought that any significant frequency reductions on the rest of the Norfolk network which they have been pursuing in Cambridgeshire would invite competition from Lynx  That would seem a fair bet as it was the way that Konect built up its network. Certainly Stagecoach East has become very risk averse recently.

From a Facebook post, it looks as if some of the detail of the handover of routes had been worked out in advance of the announcement.  It was certainly known that an announcement was coming.

The split of x29 and x8 and the Coasthopper doesn't bode well.  There were a surprising number of people who travelled across Fakenham when I travelled on the service a couple of years ago.  The driver then went round the bus collecting ENCTS passes and putting them through the machine for the x29 section.  Likewise, there is significant traffic across Wells.  If the two sections are run separately, it adds time or uncertainty into the journey which will put potential passengers off.  It also suggests that no company will have a Fakenham outstation.  The dead mileage contributed to the demise of the First service from Fakenham.


Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2018, 02:53:32 AM »
Sanders have an outstation in Fakenham whist Konnectbus is in Dereham

The 505 is a South Holland Council contract which specifies the frequency

There has been stories round here about the previous owner

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2018, 08:42:09 AM »
The speculation above seems plausible at the very least.  Surely the 505 must be profitable to maintain the frequency that it does including a Sunday service.  Hunstanton would have been more profitable without Lynx but Stagecoach must have come to the conclusion that it could not get rid of Lynx by either running it into bankruptcy or buying them out in any acceptable timescale. It is possible that they thought that any significant frequency reductions on the rest of the Norfolk network which they have been pursuing in Cambridgeshire would invite competition from Lynx  That would seem a fair bet as it was the way that Konect built up its network. Certainly Stagecoach East has become very risk averse recently.

From a Facebook post, it looks as if some of the detail of the handover of routes had been worked out in advance of the announcement.  It was certainly known that an announcement was coming.

The split of x29 and x8 and the Coasthopper doesn't bode well.  There were a surprising number of people who travelled across Fakenham when I travelled on the service a couple of years ago.  The driver then went round the bus collecting ENCTS passes and putting them through the machine for the x29 section.  Likewise, there is significant traffic across Wells.  If the two sections are run separately, it adds time or uncertainty into the journey which will put potential passengers off.  It also suggests that no company will have a Fakenham outstation.  The dead mileage contributed to the demise of the First service from Fakenham.

In one of Stagecoach East managers bizarre decisions the Coasthopper is operated in those two stages because the E200MMCs are supposed to be too wide for some sections between Wells and Cromer.
Therefore a change to a Solo is required at Wells.

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2018, 08:47:29 AM »
Sanders have an outstation in Fakenham whist Konnectbus is in Dereham

The 505 is a South Holland Council contract which specifies the frequency

There has been stories round here about the previous owner
The 505 is part of the Lincolnshire Inter Connect network but is a commercial service.
The previous operators were Fowlers who pulled out of the route because Andrew Fowler did not like the County Council involvement that was to come from joining the Inter Connect system.
It was widely believed that Fowlers were to sell the route to First but Norfolk Green got wind of it and started their own service

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #14 on: February 01, 2018, 10:07:44 PM »
In one of Stagecoach East managers bizarre decisions the Coasthopper is operated in those two stages because the E200MMCs are supposed to be too wide for some sections between Wells and Cromer.
Therefore a change to a Solo is required at Wells.

The MMC200S were due for Cambridge, they were painted into corporate colours but with a lot of breakdowns in Norfolk there was a change of plan, that's why they have the white roof

Offline Palatine One

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #15 on: February 01, 2018, 10:59:18 PM »
I thought the MMC's were for the Coasthopper...?

Certainly nothing they would have been suitable for in Cambridge at the time, especially as they had only received a batch of E200's barely a year or two beforehand.

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #16 on: February 02, 2018, 12:39:15 AM »
I thought the MMC's were for the Coasthopper...?

Certainly nothing they would have been suitable for in Cambridge at the time, especially as they had only received a batch of E200's barely a year or two beforehand.
Well they did have a special livery designed for them and it was always said they were for the Coasthopper.
However it did seem a strange order but in line with other bizarre decisions from Cambridge towards this route

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #17 on: February 02, 2018, 12:49:25 AM »
A friend of mine who lives that way has the following information - as far as I am aware not yet confirmed by the companies concerned.

"Stagecoach Norfolk Green will retain the Long Sutton outstation which supplies buses for the 505 to Spalding and the Wisbech local services all of which they will continue to operate. They will also retain the 46 to March but otherwise will pull out of Kings Lynn. This will leave Lynx as the sole operator on the Hunstanton service. Lynx will also operate the X8 to Fakenham but the X29 from Fakenham-Norwich will pass to Konect. Lynx will also operate the Coasthopper but only as far as Wells with the section from Wells-Cromer being taken over by Sanders.

Some of the more lightly trafficked town services such as the 4 (Pandora Meadows) and the 5 (Gaywood Park) may be taken over by West Norfolk Community Transport using minibuses and some Solos. Not quite sure what will happen to the busier Kings Lynn routes such as Fairstead but Lynx must be the favourite to take these on. Speculation is rife as to whether they will acquire Stagecoach Norfolk Green's operating centre in Kings Lynn and/or any vehicles/staff"

I do not know how much of this is fact or fiction, but from some of the posts I have seen some of it appears to be fact.

I am sure there will be many more more rumours before the 90 days is up.

A little bit of thought to the above regarding the 505.
The route is profitable but would Stagecoach want to hang on to it in isolation.
At present the main servicing is done at Kings Lynn and all outstation buses are rostered so they get to Kings Lynn.
If Long Sutton, which is a builders yard, stays where would the main servicing be done.
Lincolnshire Road Car operated the route profitably after deregulation even with competition from Fowlers.
However when the main servicing garage at Boston closed the route and Holbeach garage were sold to Fowlers

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #18 on: February 02, 2018, 07:53:45 AM »
The buses will be maintained at Peterborough I would have thought, Peterborough run a service to Spalding, they could link it up

They said the depot in Kings Lynn may close they could keep that open or should I say one side of the road

Offline Steven Knight Media

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #19 on: February 02, 2018, 05:10:03 PM »
I thought the MMC's were for the Coasthopper...?

Certainly nothing they would have been suitable for in Cambridge at the time, especially as they had only received a batch of E200's barely a year or two beforehand.

The Enviro 200MMCs were always ordered for Coasthopper. There was never a suggestion they were for anywhere else.

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #20 on: February 03, 2018, 03:54:14 PM »
A little bit of thought to the above regarding the 505.
The route is profitable but would Stagecoach want to hang on to it in isolation.
At present the main servicing is done at Kings Lynn and all outstation buses are rostered so they get to Kings Lynn.
If Long Sutton, which is a builders yard, stays where would the main servicing be done.
Lincolnshire Road Car operated the route profitably after deregulation even with competition from Fowlers.
However when the main servicing garage at Boston closed the route and Holbeach garage were sold to Fowlers

If not aware there is a very entertaining blog from someone who calls himself fbb at
http://publictransportexperience.blogspot.co.uk/
He has just covered the Kings Lynn goings on but also found some info on First Norwich intentions to extend a route to Fakenham in April

Online John

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #21 on: February 04, 2018, 03:07:48 AM »
How on earth does Lynx make a profit?

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #22 on: February 04, 2018, 09:25:32 AM »
This is interesting, on Firsts website they have announced an extention of their service 29 from Taverham to run as far as Fakenham which will be the X29 starting from 2nd April, also on Konnectbus site they have announced a new service between Fakenham and Norwich which starts April 18th but don't give a service number1
« Last Edit: February 04, 2018, 09:30:44 AM by Coast_Hopper »

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2018, 09:49:20 AM »
How on earth does Lynx make a profit?

They are targeting council and school contracts, they have taken all the ones they have gone in for by undercutting Stagecoach,

Offline RM471

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Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #24 on: February 05, 2018, 07:57:35 PM »
Lynx are planning to take their routes and are looking for more drivers and support staff

http://www.lynxbus.co.uk/news/press-release/

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #25 on: February 05, 2018, 08:44:49 PM »
Lynx are planning to take their routes and are looking for more drivers and support staff

http://www.lynxbus.co.uk/news/press-release/

They are going to run the Coasthopper as far as Wells, the Wells to Fakenham route and Fakenham to King's Lynn

I also suspect they will run the Fairstead and possibly North Wooton services

I have an inkling that one of the 35s will go round the Sandringham estate they they might renumber that one

Offline cesar

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #26 on: February 05, 2018, 09:28:13 PM »
Well, quite. Wouldn't want to leave Her Majesty without a bus service, would One?

Offline linkyyork

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #27 on: February 05, 2018, 11:23:00 PM »
Lynx are planning to take their routes and are looking for more drivers and support staff

http://www.lynxbus.co.uk/news/press-release/

I can hear Julian Patterson saying - everything went to plan - second large company stuffed

Offline Coast_Hopper

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #28 on: February 06, 2018, 08:44:54 AM »
I can hear Julian Patterson saying - everything went to plan - second large company stuffed

Not just the company stuffed its the passengers as well, I doubt many people will pay £20 to go on the Coasthopper to Sheringham, I for one won't I will take the car

Offline skyLink

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Re: Stagecoach Norfolk Finished
« Reply #29 on: February 06, 2018, 07:44:22 PM »
There is alot of keyboard warrior moaning about and slagging lynx off. and I Know for a fact the management of Lynx are on this group.

i would like to Highlight the Problems Stagecoach has caused to the Norfolk foke with strikes, services not running, cancelling services that lynx then picked up on behalf of N.C.C.  not to mention the balls up with the coasthopper

Also I'm reliably informed that they inspected stagecoach's tempos and turned them down due to condition. 

so well done lynx for running a service for the people and not for massive profits and standing in when a big group brings the corporate brush in and forget the public.

for the record  these are my veiws and im not coming down on one side but some one needs to stand up for the local guys
Kind regards
MR S